The Creative Spark

Expressive Arts facilitator and educator Barbara Karmazyn talks with Carol about her work and inspiration.

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Retrieving the Ancient

“We, the artists, have to appreciate that our materials already come with their own languages embedded inside of them. So our materials are already expressing themselves. So the artist interfaces with the being of the material.”

Retrieving the Ancient – James talks to Carol Sill about art.

C: Hi James. We’re sitting up here on the roof, and last night you gave your talk, an artist talk called “Is there Anything Old Here?” and just now you were mentioning that we have to retrieve the ancient. Do you want to talk a little bit about that?

J: What I said was: we have to put the brakes on and retrieve the ancient before we go forward.

C: What do you mean “we”? Who is doing this?

J: In culture. There’s a lot of energy in the direction of the new, and I’m kind of tired of it. What I want to do is make the old new, rather than make the new new.

C: And you do that in your painting work….

J: Yeah, I think there are aspects in my work that go backward rather than forward. Some observers of my work think that that’s not worthwhile but they’re just looking for the new – period. There’s so much more to perceive than the new.

C: So how do you perceive the ancient?

J: Well, you have to do your research. That’s a really good question. Where do we find the ancient? I guess one answer would be in the aspects of life that never change. Such as, the boring, banal and simple. The boring, banal and simple, I bet, is the same across time. And the thing is, that’s where the metaphysical truths are hiding in plain sight. That’s also the message of Pop Art. The Warhol soup cans, the Screen Tests that he did; there are some good lessons in Pop Art for all of us.

… is wrapped up in learning of language. I think there are only two languages to learn. One is the language of awakening, and the other is the language of materiality which artists know very well.
So on one hand we’ve got spiritual people, working hard, there. And on the other hand we’ve got cultural workers who are working hard where they are. It’s rare that those two worlds come together, and they need to come together.

C: What is the artist’s path? What is that?

J: What do I think the artist’s role is?

C: The artist’s path.

J: From what perspective?

C: Well, let’s say you were an artist and you wanted to take that way as a way of self-development and as a way of understanding the universe. What would that way be? How would you go there?

J: We have to - we: the artists, have to appreciate that our materials already come with their own languages embedded inside of them. So our materials are already expressing themselves. So the artist interfaces with the being of the material. That’s number one.

C: And things are discovered through that?

J: Well then the play begins, because you’re in play with the invisible, in a sense.

C: Would you say it’s kind of like alchemy?

J: I think so, yes. How is it that our materials, plywood, stone, canvas, paint, whatever, how is it that these materials can be as alive before we even touch them, as we are ourselves?
So when you’re making art, you’re not in it alone. The cosmos wants to play.

C: When you say you’re not really alone, are you talking about guiding spirits, that kind of thing?

J: Of course. It’s a good idea to give these guiding spirits form, and to acknowledge that that’s what you’re doing when you’re making art. In the end, you’ve given guiding spirits form. And you’ve collaborated. And they’ve chosen you, in that moment.

C: Is this like the muse, or is it past the idea of the muse?

J: It’s probably past the idea of the muse, but “the muse” will do.

C: Now some people say that everybody’s creative, and everyone has a creative ability somehow, in their life or in their work. What do you think about that?

J: Usually those statements are uninformed and misguided because on the one hand we are all striving to be artists, either in this life or the next or the one after that. At some point …

C: So you believe in the supremacy of “Art” with a capital A?

J: I believe in the supremacy of the creative process. But not everybody’s an artist – there’s no way. Let’s see your art, if you call yourself an artist. Where’s your art?

C: Can people use art as a way of awakening?

J: Well that’s what has to happen. That’s what it’s for.

C: There is some art that doesn’t seem to be referencing anything to do with awakening…

J: That’s because that art isn’t about anything. I don’t know what other reason to make art for other than to give form to the… what did you call them? Guiding spirits. If your creativity doesn’t do that, then what are you doing?

C: What would you say to somebody who is an artist but feels they’re in a bit of a box, they can’t find their way, you know, they’re caught somewhere. What kind of advice would you give somebody?

J: Where are they caught?

C: Well, maybe in themselves or in some idea of what art is or should be.

J: What would I say? …I guess try it on. If anybody wants to try on the idea that everything is will, then give it a try. I don’t think you will succeed very long. In other words, what gives our creativity its longevity? Only that depth of the infinite. If your work doesn’t have that depth then it has no longevity, and it can only have that depth if it’s in collaboration with the infinite.

C: And how do people find their way to do that?

J: Well, that’s what we’re all up against. If you’re an artist or even not an artist, we’re all looking for truth. And truth exists. And there are strategies and methods already expressed, there are clues everywhere. Artists are doing that. Read Marshall McLuhan: it’s all there. McLuhan understood the patterns of how to get there.

C: So how does being an artist change your perception of the world?

J: Well, I don’t know. I’m not sure how to answer that. How do artists see differently from non-artists?
If I’m finding answers in the boring, banal and simple, I know there aren’t very many other people doing that. That’s perception.

C: When you were talking last night, I think you were trying to help people learn to see. And that’s really difficult, to understand that language of art if you’re not an artist yourself. Is there any way that… I mean, what do you suggest to help people learn to see? To see what art is doing, or what art means.

J: I would say if you’re serious about perceiving then you’ll find the way. You just have to be serious about it. And you have to not be afraid to look bad. And not be afraid to isolate yourself as a result.

Somewhere… I read somewhere in a book about Judaism a quote from what I think was the Bible, that said: God says, “Make me known to you.” And that’s what the artist engages in. Should be, anyway. Make God known to you. Make truth known to you. Find it. Try it on. Hunt it down. Name it.

View the video of this conversation.

Retrieving the Ancient, and The Language of Art

James K-M talks with Carol Sill about art and retrieving the ancient.

“We, the artists, have to appreciate that our materials already come with their own languages embedded inside of them. So our materials are already expressing themselves. So the artist interfaces with the being of the material.”

* On the roofdeck, background sound is of the busy street below.
Link here for the text version of this conversation.

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Spirit, Creative Life, and Sharing Your Gifts

Jim and Carol discuss their thoughts on how to integrate spirituality into every aspect of our lives.

“One of the most important things to get through any blockages to creativity is to really understand that the gift is not yours. Your job is to channel, to express and as you said, the glimmer comes to you and its your job to embellish and make it more beautiful and make it more real and to bring it into expression in the world through your mind and consciousness, which makes it unique.”

Link here for the text version of this conversation.

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